3D programs

A Swedish friend of mine is about to launch her own company here in Sweden supplying solutions in interior design & architecture. Her target groups are varied, but will include private homes of the rich and municipal office space.

She has a BA (Hons) Interior Architecture from KIAD (University of Kent), obtained in 2001.

She deems it necessary to learn the computer program 3D studio max prior to starting her company. (She has no previous experience of this or any other 3D computer design program). She is skilled in both traditional drawing board and CAD diagrams so I wonder if the time needed to invest in learning such a powerful program may be superfluous to her needs. Is it common for small companies in this/these branch/es to use a 3D computer program to sell their ideas and concepts? As a layman I feel that the buyer is more interested in the idea than with its presentation, whilst on the other hand I can see why many good ideas are never sold/implemented due to poor presentation.

Bottom line: Can a professional 2D presentation suffice in today's climate or have potential customers grown so used to 3D drawings that nothing else can be considered.

Feedback please.

3D program necessary yes/no

If yes, is 3D studio max taking a sledgehammer to hit a nail? Is there another smaller 3D program that does the job?

How much full time study would be necessary to become sufficient in 3D studio max for someone who is apt at CAD?

Thanks in advance

Garry

I answered your post in the main architecture newsgroup and its just too long to post here.

Rose http://members.aol.com/Roseb44170/home.html 'How did I ever get talked into this?'

Here's my opinion:

Is computer 3d rendering necessary? No Is presentation rendering necessary? Yes, be it colored pencil sketches, watercolor, computer generated etc. Which 3D rendering package (photo-realistic)? Max is certainly good, but most likely overkill for what she needs (which makes learning it harder). If she's proficient with Autocad I'd suggest looking into getting Architectural Desktop 2004 (which includes Viz Render - a rendering package based on 3D Viz). Which 3D rendering package (non-photo-real)? SketchUp comes to mind. It's good for 'non cad' people to model quickly and it does some nice artistic rendering output. How long does it take to learn? Depends upon a lot of factors. Proficiency with CAD programs will help some with 3D rendering. As a general guideline I'd say the learning curve (for something like Viz or Max) is 3-4 months of full time work to be proficient enough to impliment into your workflow. You can turn out nice stuff in less time, but it won't look really really good, nor will it be time efficient until you know A LOT about the rendering program.

I use Architectural Desktop to build my models and then 3D Viz to apply materials, lights, cameras, etc and render. Neither of these programs is cheap (~$3800 for ADT and ~$1800 for 3D Viz) but they are powerful. The other consideration is will she have access to cad files of the project? It could be a real time saver if she can get cad files from the Architect and then work from those to do the rendering.

In my experience most Interior Decorators do hand illustrations (whether color pencil, marker, watercolor, etc) rather than 3D rendering. The problem/benefit of computer rendering is the perception of accuracy. Rendering programs CAN be very accurate, but I wouldn't rely on there accuracy for colors, fabrics, materials etc. They are good for getting a general 'feel' but hand rendering can give you the same feel without the expectation of 100% accuracy.

HTH,

Michael (LS)

And lets not bring up that *learning curve* thing.

Well said.

One interesting problem she'll need to contend with it 'only doing enough'. e.g. Right now we need to give the cities colored elevations. I could build a full 3d model in autocad and texture and light it in 3ds. It would look sweet. Instead I take the 2d elevations and color them in Photoshop. Takes a lot less time and looks fine.

None of them really are photorealistic. Some are easier to make images that look good than others. The big problem to contend with here is understanding that the computer is a limited simulation and the artist often needs to do 'what works/looks good' and not 'what should be real world correct'.

package

I much prefer ACAD for the architectural modeling, anyway. And she'll need a 2d program for the real work. Unless she does freakish organic things... then maybe a copy of Rhino would be a good add on... out of my area here though.

Wait, there's a point where I'm supposed to be done learning?

Points out that it is critical to actually know about the program. About rendering. To have a good understanding of the topic and what is going on. The 'which button am I supposed to press now' people will never do good work.

Because they are backward 'artsy' hacks.

Well said.

Just the other day I was standing in a space listening to somebody go on about how the renderings had really looked like the finished space and I was thinking 'they showed you different renderings than they showed me.'

Not trying to start a platform war here, but if she is concerned about learning curve and wants to be able to do primarily interior renderings, ADT is no way to go...learning curve is steep. Check out Revit...learning curve is much shorter and it has abuilt in accurender engine to produce nice renderings.

Also, I think Sketchup would do the trick all by itself for her. Check out the sketchup website for some excellent examples of work done in that program...it costs about $500. Revit is closer to $3000, but if you have a seat of Autocad, they are offering a great package called the Revit Series which allows you to upgrade to Revit and autocad 2004 for a very deep discount.

Also, I am surely going to get flamed here for menitoning Revit, but don't let the objections of those who have not actaully tried it tell you it is not as powerful as ADT. For interior work, you would be pleasantly surprised at how powerful it really is.

G

Thanks for all comments so far. All are being looked into and discussed. I emailed 6 interior companies in the UK and asked what they are using and what they deemed necessary, but no one replied. I asked in the UK as I am an expat, and I thought Swedish companies (small country, 8 million) may not want to aid a potential future competitor. Thank heavens for newsgroups, although I have never posted here before I have a 9 year posting history in other groups, time after time newsgroups beat all other forms of research in specialist fields (save the troll infested groups).

I will post again in a few days with an update and a few more specific details. There is some conflicting advice in this thread, but I see all are trying to genuinely help and I think the best way for my friend to go can be deduced now.

This is also a possible case of cold feet before launching her company. She obtained her degree in England 2 and a half years ago, but then discovered that it didn't open any doors with Swedish companies who prefer domestic qualifications rather than international ones. Henceforth and after a lot of thought she has decided to do it herself and launch her own comany. She is currently on a business course, learning marketing & accounting etc. The question really is when to 'let go' and jump in at the deep end. She needs premises, a laptop pc, and this and that. And now, possibly 3-4 months of full time study (3D studio max) prior to launching.

To any out there that are self employed in this branch, just when did you know that the time was right? Any feedback on that? Did you time this right? Was there anything you did unecessarily or something you wish you had have done? Can you live solely off of this income today? How long did it take you to establish yourself? (I know, lots of questions, I'm thinking out loud, any general feedback appreciated).

Garry Jones

'Garry Jones'> wrote

I worked a number of jobs, spanning about 13 years, before starting my own business at the age of 30. Basically, I got fed up with being told what to do by people less knowledgeable and skillfull than myself. Anyway, for about a year, I worked my last job full time and then did side jobs during the nights and weekends. I found my sidework more fullfilling than my day job, more money and better job satisfaction and the fact that I was in total control. Soon I found that I was capable of making much more money on my own, than at my day job. My day job was costing money as it required me to be away from my side work. So I quit my day job in 1986, bought the required licenses, established a ficticious name and the rest is history. I am not capable of working for one employer anymore. That would be the equivalent to placing all of ones (financial) eggs in one basket, and letting someone else carry the basket. Pure insanity. My one regret is that I didn't start my business alot sooner than I did. I think of all the years that I wasted in dead end jobs.......when I should have been enjoying life and wresting what I may from it. Good luck to you and your friend.